Smizik hits an all time low...

[indybucfan]

I interpreted the Smizik comment to focus only on the MLB team and not on the entire Pirates organization. I think he is right. I will take a healthy Wilson and Sanchez over Cedeno and Iwamura. I will take Adam over Clement. Batista and Andy are about a wash and Bay and McLouth are more productive than Moss and Milledge.

Daskid made the point before me. Smizik is pointing out that ownership always finds a justification to take the lower salary route.

You're certainly entitled to your opinion, but you don't have the option of Bay and McLouth over Milledge and Moss. It's over Milledge and McCutchen since they play the same positions. And I'll take Milledge and McCutchen as a set over Bay and McLouth.

[irahuss]

You're certainly entitled to your opinion, but you don't have the option of Bay and McLouth over Milledge and Moss. It's over Milledge and McCutchen since they play the same positions. And I'll take Milledge and McCutchen as a set over Bay and McLouth.

Not to mention a "healthy Wilson and Sanchez" is a once in a lifetime occurance

[Kipper]

It just seemed to me that Smizik needed another anti-Pirate piece to advance his agenda so he went fishing and made up something that just wasn't there. IMO the article was a complete piece of crap [HIGH-LIGHT]but the guys who follow him on his blog sure ate it [/HIGH-LIGHT]up!

Which is why he wrote it. If Smizik would invest time in actual research and write a blog/column that was factual and opposed his usual agenda, his "fans" would go nuts on him.

The people or fans of the Pirates have been built up over the years to be negative. Team play and losing, incompetent management, incompetent ownership (Kevin Mcclatchy), incompetent CEO that should've never been (Kevin McClatchy), no plans, no rebuilds, low payrolls... and constant media bashing except for the admiration for Littlefield and co. by Smizik back in the day... The easy route for a blogger/columnist is to simply fuel the fire to light the torches being held by the mob. Anything written that would be factual or positive or intellectual would both get lost on the the casual fan who has too much negativity built up and completely ignored.

I personally hate weak journalism and journalism with an agenda. I know that is what a majority is, still doens't make me like it any more. Problem with Pittsburgh is that the media here lacks the "good cop" journalist to oppose the bad cop. All you get is one side and in the end you wind up with a fan base that is both one sided and partially retarded

[Kipper]

Not to mention a "healthy Wilson and Sanchez" is a once in a lifetime occurance

Exactly and the problem there is that the Pirates never really had a healthy Jack and Freddy play at the same time. One would be injured or having a tough go at it and the other would do well and then reverse the roles.

Having a healthy" Wilson and Sanchez" was never part of the plan or equation cause it was never an option. Not to mention, both guys are 31-32 years old. The chances of a guy that couldn't stay healthy enough last year to trigger an extra $8 million and the other who has missed almost a full seasons worth of games (158) over the past 3 seasons ... That's like choosing an OLD clunker of a car instead of a new model.

[Kipper]

The point that Smizik keeps trying to prove is that ownership values money over winning. His go-to example to make his case is that ownership failed to pony up to keep the 2007-2008 core together.

As buccoray touched on, that group peaked at 68 wins. While there were some popular players, they were still a bad baseball team. And most of that core group was traded away at the peak of their baseball careers. That was not a team primed for improvement.

If Smizik got his way, the Pirates would now have a 68-win team with a $60M-70M payoll, a core group now almost entirely over 30 years old, and Andrew McCutchen.

To replace those aging veteran players in the next few years they would have Pedro Alvarez, Brad Lincoln, Tony Sanchez and nobody else. There would be no Lastings Milledge, no Andy LaRoche, no Ross Olendorf, no Charlie Morton, no Jose Tabata, and no Tim Alderson.

I'd be willing to bet that the current group will sniff or even exceed those 68 wins, and do it with a younger average age, a much lower payroll, and infinitely more long-term upside.

Smizik is a moron.

All excellent points. I agree 110%

What's sad is that bob Smizik isn't the only person with an aging car that leaked oil, didn't perform well, never got to most places, had a square wheel and would then turn around and tell the bank he would like to make larger payments on that car

I'm sure there's a better analogy somewhere

[jnn123]

If Smizik only would have waited one more day he would have had a quote that actually fit in with the article. This is from Andrew McCutchen:

“People won’t know how good we are going to be until they watch us. I’m not a guy who makes predictions. I don’t know what our record is going to be. What I do know is that we’re going to have a much better team because Neal Huntington went out and got a lot of good players.”

[Daskid]

If Smizik only would have waited one more day he would have had a quote that actually fit in with the article. This is from Andrew McCutchen:

“People won’t know how good we are going to be until they watch us. I’m not a guy who makes predictions. I don’t know what our record is going to be. What I do know is that we’re going to have a much better team because Neal Huntington went out and got a lot of good players.”

Maybe Smizik will say McCutchen makes "outrageous exaggerations that mislead people" and that he's "doing nothing more than taking the lead from his boss".

[vandelay industries]

[night9hawk]

Not to mention a "healthy Wilson and Sanchez" is a once in a lifetime occurance

I've heard of such things, but has anybody ever seen such a thing?

[Kipper]

I've heard of such things, but has anybody ever seen such a thing?

I thought I saw it once but it ended up being a Unicorn

[Lup]

I can't believe that I man who has been involved in the industry for this long is that stupid. It completely amazes me.

[night9hawk]

I thought I saw it once but it ended up being a Unicorn

Try drinking near beer next time.

[glscott57]

You're certainly entitled to your opinion, but you don't have the option of Bay and McLouth over Milledge and Moss. It's over Milledge and McCutchen since they play the same positions. And I'll take Milledge and McCutchen as a set over Bay and McLouth.

I do have that option. Bay in LF, McCutchen in CF, McLouth in RF.

[Kipper]

I do have that option. Bay in LF, McCutchen in CF, McLouth in RF.

So you're fine with a 30+ year old on the decline, oft injured AWFUL defensive player like Jason Bay eating up $10+ milliion for the next few years?

Is your name Cam Bonifay? If so, Jason Kendall wants a new contract

[buccoman]

So you're fine with a 30+ year old on the decline, oft injured AWFUL defensive player like Jason Bay eating up $10+ milliion for the next few years?

Is your name Cam Bonifay? If so, Jason Kendall wants a new contract

I have come to agree with you, Kip, about the need to go young while this team develops, so I am ok with the lesser developed players in the OF. However, you really **** me off when you keep referring to Jason Bay as "a player on the decline." And he is not AWFUL defensively--average maybe, but not awful. You lose credibility when you characterize players of Bay's calibre this way. What may be true is that it makes no sense to waste $$ on Bay at a time when the Pirates are not ready to compete, and that Bay could well be in decline by the time they ARE ready to compete.